'All-Rounder' Dilemma.

philh · Post by **philh** » Jul 3rd, '07, 12:58

Yo!

I'm absolutely loving life on my '03 SV650S, but I'm starting to hanker after some more top-end grunt. High speed overtakes are noticably more hesitant than my buddies on 600-1000cc in-line 4's. One chap at work has a 1050 Speed Triple which is particularly impressive! Watching him rolling on from 80-90 leaves me feeling like I've stalled or something...

So I've been thinking about moving up to something of a larger capacity. After all, 'there's no replacement for displacement'! However, one big limiting factor in my choice of machine is the fact that I epitomise the term 'all-round-biker'. I use my bike to commute in all weathers, for a spot of touring both on my own and 2up with the missus, and for Sunday morning blasts with mates. So, it has to do all that and be bombproof enough to stand up to winter rain and salt. Italian exotica are out...!

I'm tempted by a KTM SuperDuke. The prospect of a litre V-Twin is appealing and KTM's off-road heritage seems to suggest that the thing won't rot over winter. But how would I get on unfaired?

One all-rounder seems so popular that Googling 'all-rounder bike' would throw up nothing but the VFR800. The V-TEC's get slated a lot, but I like the look of the VFR and on paper at least it sounds like just the ticket for me. But is it any good?

I like the look of the new Tiger 1050. It does seem a bit too 'off-roady', but reviews rave about it's sportsbike-like capabilities...

Or do I just say "bugger-it" to all of this all-rounder nonsense and get an R1 or GSX-R750/1000. Out-and-out sportsbikes they may be, but are they just so robust that I couldn't go wrong? Plenty of people tour on machines like that!

Or, do I just stick with the SV. After all, with the exception of the 'ultimate oompf', it's doing all I ask of it perfectly. The handling is sublime! Is it worth changing just to get some more wallop?! Particularly at the potential expense of handling?

Oh, I just dont know.

I need to take some test rides, but in the meantime all suggestions/guidance will be gratefully received!

baskie · Post by **baskie** » Jul 3rd, '07, 13:08

if u can afford it get a rc45 lol, anything with a v set up wiht have loads of grunt in all gears,

vfr 750?
sv1000? will be the same just with xtra 350 cc
tl 1000 go well and are not bad all round.

but if u were gonna go for an inline 2 the world is ur oyester.

gs 1200 are awome bikes to. it really does depends totaly on what u want.

just get down to local dealer, book test drive on a wide selection of bikes, a bike from each catogory and just what ever feels best for you mate.

let us know how u get on.

Post by **TLS-Moose** » Jul 3rd, '07, 14:00

Depends on how much you want to spend ..... I love my TL for ll it's foibles, but it is now a 10yr old bike

still chucks out more welly then virtually ALL the current crop of twins though, despite what the manufacturers might claim

That said, if you don't want four cylinders and can buy newish, Aprilia Tuono, Morini Corsaro, Benelli TNT, Super Duke, Bimota (

), and don't dismiss the Beemers - remarkably competent apparently

Compared to yours, the SV1k would be interesting, and JHS in Bristol are getting 140bhp reliably (at a cost...), but in stock form compared to a TL motor it's very much an also-ran

there again, buy a good low mileage used one and for the difference in cost to a newish Tuono type thing, you could have the full 140bhp .....

In the I-4 market, the FZ1 seems to be the bike of the moment as all-rounders go,

VTR · Post by **VTR** » Jul 3rd, '07, 15:13

If it was my money I'd go for a VFR, no question. But to be fair, I've had 2 VFR 750's (both 94/95 models), the 1st I bought new & the 2nd I bought used at 7yrs old!!! I couldn't fault either of them, both were reliable, never missed a beat & only cost me consumables (tyres, oil, filters, brake/clutch fluid, etc). Used them for general transport, did a track day on the 1st one, toured with a fair amount of luggage on the 2nd (panniers, tailpack & tankbag, all fully extended).
Build quality is 2nd to none, I used them in all weathers, & I mean ALL weathers, sun, rain, sleet/snow, the lot. Neither of them lost their shine & would polish up to as good as new.
Although by modern inline 4 standards, the linear power delivery can be quite deceptive as the V 4 motor will pull all the way without any problem.
Handling is fine & you'll be able to keep up with all but the V. fastest of riders. Even with all the luggage on in December a few yrs ago I managed to see off an Aston who fancied his chances

The last of the 750's are seen by many as the best of the VFR's, but if you're after something a bit newer, I'd go for a late pre vtec version. They tend to be a similar price to the vtec's (sometimes more), I think mainly because of the cost of servicing.
Last yr I was seriously looking at getting a vtec & one dealer in Plymouth advised me not because of the cost of the servicing, even though he'd got a couple in the showroom. He said that just to do the 16k valve check would cost £600 - £700

This was confirmed with e-mail enquiries to a few dealers who all came back with a similar quote. You'll notice a fair few for sale at or around the 16k or 32k mark because owners chop them in before this costly service.

I suppose the only thing to do is give one a test ride & see how you like it.

watters · Post by **watters** » Jul 3rd, '07, 15:57

hayabusa, big bike and nice and comfortable for touring and also plenty of oomph!!!

Funky · Post by **Funky** » Jul 3rd, '07, 16:37

I'd go for the VFR as that is the ultimate all rounder. Fazer's seem to be a good alround choice, I've spoken to one guy who comes over to torquay from europe every month on his.

The TL is an awesome and I'm considering it for my next purchase.

You could buy my R6 off me...

tomr6 · Post by **tomr6** » Jul 3rd, '07, 17:00

Buy my R6 for playing and keep your SV for going to Tescos for the shopping. See the for sale section on here.

deej · Post by **deej** » Jul 3rd, '07, 22:31

the superduke is a cracking bike, check last years performance bike test circuit results, beat all standard sportsbike through useable power and sublime handling and it looks fun to, sounds awesome with a set of akropovics fitted

dont buy a r1 or gsxr1000 for everyday commuting as you'll be looking at a new rear tyre every 2500miles max and they aint cheap,plus account for for the fact the brake pads/chain sprockets are high performance items that work well but arent cheap to replace.

r1dave · Post by **r1dave** » Jul 4th, '07, 00:31

Hi m8 test ride as many as you can and see whats right for you not what your mates have

philh · Post by **philh** » Jul 4th, '07, 07:56

Hey, thanks everyone. Cheers for the help.

I popped down to see the chaps at Speed Superbikes last night. I've known Graham and Martin for a while, so I thought I'd see what they have down there. Lo and behold, an VFR for sale.

I do really quite like the look of 'em. This one was red so it wont match my leathers though...

There's two things on my mind now... (Yes, an all time record!

)

One, this servicing cost. VTR, are you serious? £600 - £700?!?!?!

Thats nuts. Crazy. The VTEC lump puts me off. Not because of the 'unexpected surges' that ham-fisted reviewers talk about, but because of what whiffs to me of over-engineering.
I enjoy doing basic work on my SV. Two pots, two carbs, too easy!

This V4 VTEC doo-dah seems way complicated. I dont mind paying for a service, but not when it's as much as a whole new set of riding gear.

And two, the cost of a decent used VFR. Looking at what's out there I'm expecting to have to fork out up to £5k. It occurs to me that with £5k in my sweaty mitt, I have to walk past quite a bit of other nice used kit to jump on the VFR. £5k can buy quite a bit. Is a used VFR still the best prize for my cash?

Bloody motorcycling. So much fun, so much shiny metal... To make it all even more daft, my ride into work this morning was a blast. I can chuck my SV about like a BMX

and my brief encounter with the A30 still allowed me to hit an indicated 130mph. Thats plenty fast enough in my book. Is it really worth ditching the SV just for some extra midrange?

clunk · Post by **clunk** » Jul 4th, '07, 08:35

I'll be selling my 05 reg Kawasaki ZRX1200R soon, after I get back from holiday, Plenty of low down grunt you only get with big ccs.

I'll put a proper for sale post up in a couple of weeks.

roper · Post by **roper** » Jul 4th, '07, 08:40

As has already been said , and excuse me for stating the obvious but if you love the sv so much just get an sv 1000.

Little Loris · Post by **Little Loris** » Jul 4th, '07, 09:43

Why do you need a 600/1000cc bike to overtake cars?

Keep your SV and get a track-prepped R6 and race your mates that way. With £5k and what you save on tax, insurance, speeding fines, MOT etc, you could do some track days and/or racing?

Whatever you go for, good luck!

VTR · Post by **VTR** » Jul 4th, '07, 10:54

philh wrote:One, this servicing cost. VTR, are you serious? £600 - £700?!?!?! Thats nuts. Crazy. The VTEC lump puts me off. Not because of the 'unexpected surges' that ham-fisted reviewers talk about, but because of what whiffs to me of over-engineering.
I enjoy doing basic work on my SV. Two pots, two carbs, too easy! This V4 VTEC doo-dah seems way complicated. I dont mind paying for a service, but not when it's as much as a whole new set of riding gear.

Unfortunately yes I am, here's the e-mail I recieved;-

Mr ******

If you're looking at the 16,000 Mile service which is the first scheduled valve clearance the cost would be about £600 + the parts.

If this hasn't aswered your question or you require further information please do not hesitate to contact me.

Many thanks

Manda

The reason it's so expensive is because the cams need to be removed to lock the vtec system, put the cams back in again, then check the clearances. If everything is ok, the cams have to be removed again to unlock the vtec system & re-install the cams again. So unlike a conventional system you've got all that work just to check them, even more if the clearances need adjusting.
To me Honda made 2 mistakes with the vtec model, 1 going back to cam chains instead of the gear driven cams that were as good as bullet proof. I've never heard of any problems with gear driven cams, but have heard a few tales of chain/tensioner problems.
2 the vtec system while being a great inovation, wasn't needed & just added complexity & unwanted cost to servicing. It's a pity Honda couldn't have made locking the vtec system easier, ie without having to remove the cams.
As most of the time there's only 2 valves per cylinder working, & thus getting the most wear, I've heard of people just checking those 2 & not all 4, & so saving a bit of cash.

philh wrote:And two, the cost of a decent used VFR. Looking at what's out there I'm expecting to have to fork out up to £5k. It occurs to me that with £5k in my sweaty mitt, I have to walk past quite a bit of other nice used kit to jump on the VFR. £5k can buy quite a bit. Is a used VFR still the best prize for my cash?

VFR's have always held their value well, which is good if you're a seller, but not so good if you're a buyer. However, the quality of the bike really is worth the extra, IMO. Plus VFR's tend to be owned by, shall we say, the elder generation, so don't tend to be thrashed & are well looked after. Mileage isn't really an issue with a VFR, it's been reported that with regular maintenance they can go past 100k miles without any trouble.

Like I said before, I'd go for the pre vtec model, but even the last ones are 4 -5yrs old now. Alternatively, you could get a vtec that's just had the valves done, run it till it's near the 30k miles mark, then px it for another/something else.

As you've probably gathered, I loved my VFR's, they were great bikes, & I have to say I'm looking at getting another one soon. I could relax, just ride & take in the scenery, or hoon around pretending to be Colin Edwards dragging the pegs & end up having a huge grin on my face. It's been said before by many a journo, but I found them to really be the best all round bike.

As has already been said, test ride a few & see what you think.

P.S. Just done a quick search of Biketrader & there's a fair few below £5k, even vtec's.

philh · Post by **philh** » Jul 18th, '07, 11:40

Howdee!

Many, many thanks you lot for your input. You'll be pleased to know that the matter is settled. I'm now the proud owner of an SV1000S. My my, it is a bit more 'oomphy' than the 650!

(...and todays 'state-the-bleedin-obvious' prize goes to...... Phil! Yay!)